Curse

ZenRgy · Jan 28, 2008, 01:50 AM // 01:50

To be serious, Barrage is meant to be spammed, but your build can't do that unless everything is super balled up - this is why your build is bad and disliked, and the fact that it is incredibly inferior to a regular warrior, or B/P ranger.

So srsly

Stop! use a goddamn melee weapon time!

Taurucis · Jan 28, 2008, 02:01 AM // 02:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZenRgy

To be serious, Barrage is meant to be spammed, but your build can't do that unless everything is super balled up - this is why your build is bad and disliked, and the fact that it is incredibly inferior to a regular warrior, or B/P ranger.

Let's say I want the Urgoz monument, what do you expect me to do? Leech?

Dr Strangelove · Jan 28, 2008, 02:23 AM // 02:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taurucis

Let's say I want the Urgoz monument, what do you expect me to do? Leech?

A warrior friend of mine ran a spearchucker build with the PvE traps. Wasn't great, but it was better than this.

ZenRgy · Jan 28, 2008, 02:24 AM // 02:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taurucis

Let's say I want the Urgoz monument, what do you expect me to do? Leech?

You could probably just Ursan it or while we're talking about bad warrior builds, you could play W/N orders.

Taurucis · Jan 28, 2008, 02:28 AM // 02:28

You people really hate me, don't you?

Is it that much of a crime to suggest a build that melts down the barrier between two classes? If it is, why were we given the option of a secondary class? Why was Guild Wars not made so that we can only have one class?

ZenRgy · Jan 28, 2008, 02:39 AM // 02:39

People don't have a problem with builds that use synergy between their professions (IWAY comes to mind with W/R).

The problem isn't that you're using your secondary, it's the fact that it's such a bad way to do so.

jimmyboveto · Jan 28, 2008, 02:48 AM // 02:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amy Awien

I can't decide what's best for you but the way it sounds perhaps a temporary break might help, I know I need them once in a while.

Ya, there have been tons of times where I get sick of GW and I tell my friends "ya I quit playing GW today." About a month later I have a sudden urge to play and become addicted again.

Oh and for the urgoz monument you can go ursanway. Not sure if there area lot of PUGs doing it but I know of some friends that have steamrolled urgoz with ursanway.

horseradish · Jan 28, 2008, 02:51 AM // 02:51

If you absolutely need a reason to play GW or you'll quit, then just quit. Guild Wars is supposed to be fun and competitive, but it doesn't seem that way for you. It sounds boring and the only thing keeping you playing is a fricking bird.

Hell, I quit for a while, but now I'm back. It's not a big deal, dude.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taurucis

You people really me, don't you?

Is it that much of a crime to suggest a build that melts down the barrier between two classes? If it is, why were we given the option of a secondary class? Why was Guild Wars not made so that we can only have one class?

IMHO, the reason we have second professions is to diversify builds. It doesn't make sense to make one profession just to play it as another because it always ends up as a gimped sub par character.

Your build is average. Passable, but it's not letting your warrior use it's strengths to the best of it's ability. Why hinder yourself and your character's potential?

This is how I see it: you either evolve or you die. It's an improvement or a waste. Your build is different and avant-garde, but it's not an improvement, and improving is the only way to change people's minds. Just because it's decent doesn't mean it's good.

I'm sure you're a creative guy. You'll be able to come up with another build. A better build.

bathazard · Jan 28, 2008, 03:03 AM // 03:03

ok i understnad you man but...
you build its diffrent people don't like diffrent.
its not the best but barrage isn't the best so who can complain?
i reccomend not using a bow i know you really have to but warriors are amazing in the front line. No offence but you are wasting you possibilities on a bow? when you could be taking all the damage.
Iway was the best w/r build and w/r are quite good...(even though wiki noobs don't think so...) but you should run a melee even though you build is good. it won't compare to the +150 damage i can get on my ranger with barrage. also PuG's will hate you, you will be the "Noob" nobody likes...
if you really have to run bow well then go ahead but a warrior is a frontline charecter a great class, and i would hate to see them wasted in the back lines where there amour is useless. if you really have to run a bow build just keep on exsperimenting. mabye a build that can swap from bow to melee? but then i asure you, you will get flammed for that to so just try your best if you understand botha ranger and a warrior you will be fine

. So enjoy the good times.

Taurucis · Jan 28, 2008, 03:06 AM // 03:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by horseradish

If you absolutely need a reason to play GW or you'll quit, then just quit. Guild Wars is supposed to be fun and competitive, but it doesn't seem that way for you. It sounds boring and the only thing keeping you playing is a fricking bird.

Hell, I quit for a while, but now I'm back. It's not a big deal, dude.

The problem is that Guild Wars is too competitive, and not fun enough. There's too much team spirit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by horseradish

IMHO, the reason we have second professions is to diversify builds. It doesn't make sense to make one profession just to play it as another because it always ends up as a gimped sub par character.

Then why do most builds consist of 6 or 7 from the primary, and the secondary being Mo, Rt, or P, just for a hard rez? That's not really diverse.

Quote:

Originally Posted by horseradish

Your build is average. Passable, but it's not letting your warrior use it's strengths to the best of it's ability. Why hinder yourself and your character's potential?

If it's average, why does this entire forum and half my alliance treat me like I'm the village idiot for suggesting it?

Quote:

Originally Posted by horseradish

This is how I see it: you either evolve or you die. It's an improvement or a waste. Your build is different and avant-garde, but it's not an improvement, and improving is the only way to change people's minds. Just because it's decent doesn't mean it's good.

As I like to say, "There are two ways to get your point across. The first is to explain to them that your idea has merit. The second is to hurt them until they agree with you."

My guild won't even let me show my build, maybe I should try the second one.

Quote:

Originally Posted by horseradish

I'm sure you're a creative guy. You'll be able to come up with another build. A better build.

It is always the creative people who are persecuted first, because we stand out.

bosstweed · Jan 28, 2008, 03:24 AM // 03:24

I see where you are coming from. You just want to do something different.

Its just that GW is all about effectivness.

A warrior barrager must look badass, though.

horseradish · Jan 28, 2008, 03:56 AM // 03:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taurucis

The problem is that Guild Wars is too competitive, and not fun enough. There's too much team spirit.

If it's too competetive for your liking, well, no one is forcing you to play. It's a team based game, and it might not suit you afterall. If you want a more entertaining and fun game, then perhaps you can join a less intense guild or whatever.

Quote:

Then why do most builds consist of 6 or 7 from the primary, and the secondary being Mo, Rt, or P, just for a hard rez? That's not really diverse.

The reason why is because every profession can function on it's own. It's not mandatory to take 3 or 4 skills from your secondary, and it's often a hindrance to bring anymore. It's only an option to do so. a W/E who brings Grasping Earth instead of Shock is diverse enough. Diversity does not have to be completely different from something else. Nothing can exist in that sense. The fact that a template has been minutely changed in function is diverse enough.

Quote:

If it's average, why does this entire forum and half my alliance treat me like I'm the village idiot for suggesting it?

It's the nature of society. Conformity ftw. Most people are blind to new things and automatically dismiss it, and the majority are indiscriminate in doing so. It doesn't matter if you reinvent the wheel by making it better or making it worse, no matter how persuasive you are, you can't change peoples minds. It's up to them.

btw, some of the people here are being nice to you.

Quote:

As I like to say, "There are two ways to get your point across. The first is to explain to them that your idea has merit. The second is to hurt them until they agree with you."

My guild won't even let me show my build, maybe I should try the second one.

Frankly, your second option is stupid. It would be more beneficial to just create another build.

Quote:

It is always the creative people who are persecuted first, because we stand out.

true true, but there's a difference in terms of creativity. Picasso and Dahli were creative and people praise their artwork. Can't say the same for the plethora of creative-but-mediocre artists.

Scary Raebbit · Jan 28, 2008, 05:36 AM // 05:36

Ferocious Strike and a melee weapon
Wait, that is still bad.

ShadowbaneX · Jan 28, 2008, 06:37 AM // 06:37

alot of guild wars is about optimization. Getting just that little bit extra out of, well, everything. I mean if you think about it, what's an extra 15% damage when most of the time you're hitting for 10-20 damage? Well it's 1.5 to 3 extra damage. What's 14%? Just slightly less. Thing is no one will touch that 14^50 weapon though.

Why? It's all about optimization. It's all about getting that one extra percent, even though in reality it's only a couple of damage every hit. In the case of your build, it's operating a great deal less effectively then what a ranger or even an assassin could do. An assassin would have the option of putting alot of points into Critical Strikes and adding Way of the Master, Critical Eye and even Critical Agility for a really good crit chance to keep their energy levels up and an amazing IAS.

You yourself admitted that it's an average build, but, unfortunately, it's also a sub-par build, par, in Guild Wars terms being very efficient, well above-average builds. In terms of general effectiveness your build just cannot compare against the other builds out there. Granted, the people here would rather just sit back and stroke their own egos by putting you and your build down, rather then being helpful. I to would like to be more helpful, but what a warrior can bring to a barrage build is, unfortunately, very minimal.

I mean, having "save yourselves!" is a nice touch, but you could also get that just from going Ranger/Warrior. Adrenaline still builds the same way for all the classes. Signet of Strength and Flail are nice, yes, but you'd get about the same damage from having say 16 in Marksmanship and there are several nice IAS's available to the Ranger in their own attributes. You also have the armour penetration of strength, but again that's not much of a bonus. The other Strength skills just cannot aid Barrage in any true significant way.

So in answer to your original post, I don't think there is any way to polish the build you have. There just aren't any tools available to you as a warrior to make it work as well as a ranger could.

Pets are not entirely useless to a warrior though. One of my guild-mates runs his warrior as W/R using a basic axe build as a 1.5x tank, using the pet to help absorb some of the damage. He also says that his pet makes a good aggro-break for running, ie the monsters will start wailing on the pet allowing him to get free.

I wish you the best in getting to People Know Me and getting your Rainbow Phoenix, but I just don't think you'll be able to find a worthwhile build to use with a pet.

Yichi · Jan 28, 2008, 06:46 AM // 06:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taurucis

The problem is that Guild Wars is too competitive, and not fun enough. There's too much team spirit.

No the problem is that people try to come up with creative bullshit that just ends up being bad and making them a worse player for it. Then they throw a hissy fit when no one wants to play with them due to the fact of them being bad.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taurucis

Then why do most builds consist of 6 or 7 from the primary, and the secondary being Mo, Rt, or P, just for a hard rez? That's not really diverse.

Because 99% of all builds use their primary for a reason. There is ALWAYS a reason to use your primary instead of throwing it onto another class as a secondary. In this case its expertise and having a higher energy pool/regen to make the build work properly. If a warrior was ment to use a bow, then it would have had a better layout for using one and has adrenaline attacks that suited the warrior using a ranged weapon properly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taurucis

If it's average, why does this entire forum and half my alliance treat me like I'm the village idiot for suggesting it?

Because your alliance has common sense. I mean honestly, do you really need this response pointed out to you if they all pointed it out to you the first 900 times? The build isn't average, its terrible. But only terrible players can;t recognize it as terrible and actually want to use something like this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taurucis

As I like to say, "There are two ways to get your point across. The first is to explain to them that your idea has merit. The second is to hurt them until they agree with you."

One, If you had a point to get across that actually had merit, that idea might work. But 9 times out of 10, the guy you try to hurt, will end up beating your ass...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taurucis

My guild won't even let me show my build, maybe I should try the second one.

So you can't accept that your idea is bad and want to force others into agreeing with you? Nice try.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Taurucis

It is always the creative people who are persecuted first, because we stand out.

Creative people are persecuted when the idea that they have actually threatens the norm by either meeting the standard or surpassing it. Your creativity does neither.

Pyro maniac · Jan 28, 2008, 10:36 AM // 10:36

[skill]Ferocious Strike[/skill][skill]Hammer Bash[/skill][skill]Crushing Blow[/skill][skill]Charm Animal[/skill][skill]Comfort Animal[/skill][skill]Resurrection Signet[/skill]+ 2 optional skills like [skill]Bestial Mauling[/skill][skill]Call of Haste[/skill]

Not very good, however it does allow you to keep a pet next to a warrior. Only use in normal mode tho ;-)

Chrono Re delle Ere · Jan 28, 2008, 01:40 PM // 13:40

Actually Ferocious strike is not THAT bad, the prob with barrage is the energy...
I would suggest an IAS stance for yourself (anyone said Flail?) + Call of Haste for Pet. Go on and use Brawlers Headbutt + some more attack skills that require high adrenaline input. Will be funny and there won't surely be energy problems. Furthermore a pet higly increase you DPS. As you will be mostly like using this build for some guild fun / hench thing, you can also take off any kind of res skill (aka resurrection signet) and put in SY. If possible bring in FGJ.

Now I wanna try this thing out xD

Crom The Pale · Jan 28, 2008, 03:28 PM // 15:28

There is nothing wrong with being creative, but most people come to this forum for the honest truth, regardless of how good or bad it may be.

A war with a bow will never be the equal of a ranger nor will its damage equal that of most normal war builds.

That being said it can be fun to play so go ahead and do so, just be aware that most people in this forum will flame you simply because its not the most efficient build you can make.

I have run a war/ranger with a pet myself, both with a bow and with an Axe. Now I never tested the bow on the Master of Damage, but the axe + pet gave me 68DPS and a spike of 181dmg. This seamed far better than what I was dealing ingame with the bow so I switched.

Do not be afraid to run an inefficient build, just don't expect others to praise you for it.

Whiskeyjack · Jan 28, 2008, 03:34 PM // 15:34

How to polish? You can't polish a turd -quit guildwars.

Taurucis · Jan 28, 2008, 03:40 PM // 15:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by horseradish

If it's too competetive for your liking, well, no one is forcing you to play. It's a team based game, and it might not suit you afterall. If you want a more entertaining and fun game, then perhaps you can join a less intense guild or whatever.

Actually, my guild, as of late, isn't really intense. What I meant is Pugging, which I've been resorting to lately since my guild seems to be avoiding me. There's too much team spirit.

Quote:

Originally Posted by horseradish

The reason why is because every profession can function on it's own. It's not mandatory to take 3 or 4 skills from your secondary, and it's often a hindrance to bring anymore. It's only an option to do so. a W/E who brings Grasping Earth instead of Shock is diverse enough. Diversity does not have to be completely different from something else. Nothing can exist in that sense. The fact that a template has been minutely changed in function is diverse enough.

What I meant is, if it was going to be such a taboo to use more than one or two skills from your secondary, then why was the dual class system implemented?

Quote:

Originally Posted by horseradish

It's the nature of society. Conformity ftw. Most people are blind to new things and automatically dismiss it, and the majority are indiscriminate in doing so. It doesn't matter if you reinvent the wheel by making it better or making it worse, no matter how persuasive you are, you can't change peoples minds. It's up to them.

Which is why I hate society and hope it dies.

Quote:

Originally Posted by horseradish

btw, some of the people here are being nice to you.

I wish I could say the same for my guild.

Quote:

Originally Posted by horseradish

Frankly, your second option is stupid. It would be more beneficial to just create another build.

Creating another build would just be a waste of time, because my guild is too set in their generic ways.

Quote:

Originally Posted by horseradish

true true, but there's a difference in terms of creativity. Picasso and Dahli were creative and people praise their artwork. Can't say the same for the plethora of creative-but-mediocre artists.

Before B/P and Tombs farming came out, it was thought that any Ranger who brought a pet was an idiot. You could zone into a map "Wtf noob ranger with pet" or you could get into RA "LOL RANGER WITH PET" and get humiliated. Now, rangers with pets are actually accepted. If an idea is wild or creative enough, eventually people will try it out.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowbaneX

alot of guild wars is about optimization. Getting just that little bit extra out of, well, everything. I mean if you think about it, what's an extra 15% damage when most of the time you're hitting for 10-20 damage? Well it's 1.5 to 3 extra damage. What's 14%? Just slightly less. Thing is no one will touch that 14^50 weapon though.

I didn't say that this build was supposed to outdo every single B/P build out there. It is a build that allows a Warrior to do things that he/she wouldn't be allowed to, like Urgoz and Tombs runs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowbaneX

Why? It's all about optimization. It's all about getting that one extra percent, even though in reality it's only a couple of damage every hit. In the case of your build, it's operating a great deal less effectively then what a ranger or even an assassin could do. An assassin would have the option of putting alot of points into Critical Strikes and adding Way of the Master, Critical Eye and even Critical Agility for a really good crit chance to keep their energy levels up and an amazing IAS.

Flail is an IAS, and my energy was relatively stable with a Zealous bow.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowbaneX

You yourself admitted that it's an average build, but, unfortunately, it's also a sub-par build, par, in Guild Wars terms being very efficient, well above-average builds. In terms of general effectiveness your build just cannot compare against the other builds out there. Granted, the people here would rather just sit back and stroke their own egos by putting you and your build down, rather then being helpful. I to would like to be more helpful, but what a warrior can bring to a barrage build is, unfortunately, very minimal.

So let's say I want the Urgoz monument on my Warrior. What do you expect me to do, leech? Use Ursan and screw up aggro?

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowbaneX

I mean, having "save yourselves!" is a nice touch, but you could also get that just from going Ranger/Warrior. Adrenaline still builds the same way for all the classes. Signet of Strength and Flail are nice, yes, but you'd get about the same damage from having say 16 in Marksmanship and there are several nice IAS's available to the Ranger in their own attributes. You also have the armour penetration of strength, but again that's not much of a bonus. The other Strength skills just cannot aid Barrage in any true significant way.

Actually, I have never hit 105 with Barrage on my Ranger, even with 16 marksmanship.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowbaneX

So in answer to your original post, I don't think there is any way to polish the build you have. There just aren't any tools available to you as a warrior to make it work as well as a ranger could.

That's what I thought as well... I searched through every warrior skill, and every Norn/Asura/Vanguard skill. I couldn't find anything that might help.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowbaneX

Pets are not entirely useless to a warrior though. One of my guild-mates runs his warrior as W/R using a basic axe build as a 1.5x tank, using the pet to help absorb some of the damage. He also says that his pet makes a good aggro-break for running, ie the monsters will start wailing on the pet allowing him to get free.

That's actually a good idea, I might try it out. But last night, me and someone from my alliance tried my build out in Sorrow's Furnace. Energy use was a little higher (due to using "I Am The Strongest!" instead of "Dodge This!") but I still did good damage and my energy was stable

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowbaneX

I wish you the best in getting to People Know Me and getting your Rainbow Phoenix, but I just don't think you'll be able to find a worthwhile build to use with a pet.

I don't think I'm going to bother anymore. If everyone's going to be a jackass to me for thinking outside the box, then I might as well not even try.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yichi

TL;DR

I know what you do well enough to not take anything you say seriously. You're pretty much King Flamer around here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyro maniac

[skill]Ferocious Strike[/skill][skill]Hammer Bash[/skill][skill]Crushing Blow[/skill][skill]Charm Animal[/skill][skill]Comfort Animal[/skill][skill]Resurrection Signet[/skill]+ 2 optional skills like [skill]Bestial Mauling[/skill][skill]Call of Haste[/skill]

Not very good, however it does allow you to keep a pet next to a warrior. Only use in normal mode tho ;-)

To be honest, I have a skillbar that looks something like that, except it looks more like a Rampage As One thumper - except instead of RaO, I use Heal as One. It worked in Hard Mode and ABs.